The True Truth

[WarningU2]

The American people wish to announce that we have aligned ourselves with the true "truth".   Our freedom of thought is not manipulated by others despite suggestions of the same from other less superior civilizations ruled by what must be fanatics.   

[DribNairb]

Following false truths will only lead to your own downfall. It is a sad day to see a small nation bullied by his larger neighbour into making decisions which cost lives. Remember, Greece destroyed a nation purely for land gain. In those times America were against such a move. Yet now they are clearly forced with an iron grip or risk losing their own identity.

Mind manipulation is the domain of the dokko. (We still have not completely determined if their technology has been eliminated).

I assume you are referring to The Founders when you talk about fanatics. We are, of course, fanatical about The Truth. We follow The Path since birth and live our lives fruitfully, successfully and happily. We only wish to share this with others. If you choose to go to war you do so with open eyes knowing the consequences.

[Levgre]

While it may have been the wrong choice of Glaukos to invade the (likely) peaceful Canadians many years ago, it was done out of fear for the continuing existence of his country.  The Canadians under Greek rule have been allowed to continue to live their lives as they wish, as Greece is a country which aspires for tolerance, unlike the Founders, who demand homogeneity.  And the Americans can make decisions for themselves.

Andronikos

[Rennald Skarsgard]

You chose death?  What kind of leader are you?  While my men have their way with your women and animals, I will ponder your ignorance.  The Truth is the only way.  May the founders have the mercy on your pathetic soul that I will not.

[DribNairb]

You chose death?  What kind of leader are you?  While my men have their way with your women and animals, I will ponder your ignorance.  The Truth is the only way.  May the founders have the mercy on your pathetic soul that I will not.

Most interesting information - this is clearly not the way of The Founders. We have never chosen war, rape and pillaging. In fact, I personally disagree with everything Rennald has said.

However, Skarsgardia follows The Path. This is not cause for war, but cause for celebration. Rennald will be a permanent friend of The Founders. Every nation is entitled to their own identity and sovereignty. They simply must not attempt to undermine The Path. It has been this way since the dawn of time. It will always be this way.

I find it difficult to comprehend how others do not understand this. The Words have been on the stone tablet for eons and have been visible to all since the dawn of time.

[da_Vinci]

- this is clearly not the way of The Founders. We have never chosen war, rape and pillaging. In fact, I personally disagree with everything Rennald has said.

However, Skarsgardia follows The Path. This is not cause for war, but cause for celebration. Rennald will be a permanent friend of The Founders.

Woo Li, our senior Monk, is most distressed upon hearing this.  He asks:

"If Skarsgardia follows a way that is not the way of The Founders, and The Founders follow The Path, then how can Skarsgardia follow The Path?  Does The Path equally include the merciless mercenary maleovlence of Skarsgardia, and the alleged pure virtue of The Founders?  Does The Path equally reward Good and Evil?  We are begining to fear that The Path is a masquerade for Evil, with the proof out of your own mouth!  What explanation can you provide?"

Xiaowen, First Emperor of the Wei Dynasty

[DribNairb]

Perhaps feeble minds cannot comprehend - I will try to elaborate:

The Path only forms part of one's life. To believe in The Truth is to believe in The One. To follow The Path is to live by The Words.

If such beliefs prevented freedom of thought and expression we would be no better than the dokko! There is no fixed requirement needed to follow The Path. There is no single belief in The Truth. How you lead your life according to The Path before you is up to the individual.

I encourage your monks to come on a pilgramage to read The Words for themselves. They are freely available in the museum of our capital city. It is most unfortunate that those who have not read The Words have chosen to use The Truth as reason for their wars in order to fulfil their greed. I urge you not to fall into the same category.

[da_Vinci]

Perhaps feeble minds cannot comprehend - I will try to elaborate:

The Path only forms part of one's life. To believe in The Truth is to believe in The One. To follow The Path is to live by The Words.

If such beliefs prevented freedom of thought and expression we would be no better than the dokko! There is no fixed requirement needed to follow The Path. There is no single belief in The Truth. How you lead your life according to The Path before you is up to the individual.

Woo Li, in a rather agitated state, has asked me to convey this reply:

"More likely feeble minds, so long indoctrinated, cannot recognize the inconsistency in their own thought ...

If to follow The Path is to live by The Words, then what if anything do The Words require of a person?  If, as you say, there is no fixed requirement needed to follow The Path, then how does one distinguish someone on The Path from someone who is not?  By such a criterion, is not everyone already on The Path?

It seems odd that you are so prepared to shed so much blood, to spread The Words and The Path which you now say asks no fixed requirement of a person.  If The Path and The Words are as you say, then it hardly seems justification for violence."

Xiaowen, First Emperor of the Wei Dynasty

[DribNairb]

Come - read The Words for yourself and you will see.

It is not difficult to understand that you may follow The Path and heed The Words without having a single minded approach to everything in the world. The Path guides you to your destiny. It does not foretell precisely how you get there but it will show you the way. Each individual can choose how to follow The Path as long as they believe The Truth.

Perhaps I should try a simple lesson our 4 year olds are taught. You do understand the concept of Mathematics do you not? 

5 + 5 = 10

A simple equation. And according to mathematical laws (analagous to The Words) it is true (analagous to The Truth).

Yet 4 + 6 = 10 is equally as true. As is 6 + 4 = 10. There are some who would go so far as to say 15 + -5 = 10 is true. Despite the latter being far more complicated it is completely true. However, many 4 year olds do not fully understand it (analagous to those in your position who do not follow The Path).

As a person who believes in mathematics you must accept any of these equations. Just as a person who believes in The Truth must accept The Path.

But if someone told you 5 + 5 = 9 and attempted to teach this to all your children you would surely be upset at the very least. To those who follow The Path such blasphemy causes much, much deeper feelings (cause for war). This has been The Truth since the dawn of time and we have said as much publically since 4000BC when my forefathers opened the first holy display (now available in our embassy).

[da_Vinci]

Come - read The Words for yourself and you will see.

It is not difficult to understand that you may follow The Path and heed The Words without having a single minded approach to everything in the world. The Path guides you to your destiny. It does not foretell precisely how you get there but it will show you the way. Each individual can choose how to follow The Path as long as they believe The Truth.

Perhaps I should try a simple lesson our 4 year olds are taught. You do understand the concept of Mathematics do you not? 

5 + 5 = 10

A simple equation. And according to mathematical laws (analagous to The Words) it is true (analagous to The Truth).

Yet 4 + 6 = 10 is equally as true. As is 6 + 4 = 10. There are some who would go so far as to say 15 + -5 = 10 is true. Despite the latter being far more complicated it is completely true. However, many 4 year olds do not fully understand it (analagous to those in your position who do not follow The Path).

As a person who believes in mathematics you must accept any of these equations. Just as a person who believes in The Truth must accept The Path.

Woo Li is now most puzzled:

"Your example of The Math has not answered our questions about The Path:

'If to follow The Path is to live by The Words, then what if anything do The Words require of a person?  If, as you say, there is no fixed requirement needed to follow The Path, then how does one distinguish someone on The Path from someone who is not?  By such a criterion, is not everyone already on The Path?'

The Math also suggests that rather than believing in The Path, perhaps you really believe in The Destination?  As apparently, multiple paths are allowed?  But wait, multiple destinations are also allowed, as The Path simply leads one to one's destiny?  So a person destined for evil, pursuing evil, is following The Path (the Skarsgardian way?)?  If so, this would confirm that everyone is already on The Path, and you need not spend any effort, nor shed any blood, spreading your belief.  There appears to be no difference between being on their path and being on The Path.

If The Words do not call a person to pursue good and reject evil, then what is the value of The Words?  The Words, The Path, and the Truth should all call a person to be better than they are now ... not simply to be as they are now.

Xiaowen, First Emperor of the Wei Dynasty

[DribNairb]

The math is meant to be a simple illustration. To take it too literally is to miss the point. The Truth is far more complicated than that and can take a lifetime to understand everything.

the destination you talk about is the destiny of the world. But the world will continue long after we are gone, so there is no ultimate destination.

Let me try again - you may walk a normal path by putting one foot in front of the other, or by jumping or by crawling. They are both the same path. There is no right or wrong way. There are points on The Path, propheted long ago. They all have or will come to pass.

To tread a different route is merely to ignore The Path and ignore your calling. To suggest we should all abandon The Path or walk backwards would be considered blasphemy.

The Path is defined in The Words. There is nothing to specify pursuing good or rejecting evil. I personally try to persue good but it is not a requirement to acknowledge The Truth. The Truth is not a belief, it is simply The Truth.

Again, I invite your monks to spend time learning about The Truth. Our children spend many years learning and I cannot hope to let you comprehend by mere messenger.

[Capsavian Hopewell]

In fact, I personally disagree with everything Rennald has said.

OOC:  Who could protest bestiality?!      

This is the problem with owning a pitbull;  they sometimes slobber on the carpet.  Or hump your leg.

[da_Vinci]

Let me try again - you may walk a normal path by putting one foot in front of the other, or by jumping or by crawling. They are both the same path. There is no right or wrong way. There are points on The Path, propheted long ago. They all have or will come to pass.

To tread a different route is merely to ignore The Path and ignore your calling. To suggest we should all abandon The Path or walk backwards would be considered blasphemy.

The Path is defined in The Words. There is nothing to specify pursuing good or rejecting evil. I personally try to persue good but it is not a requirement to acknowledge The Truth. The Truth is not a belief, it is simply The Truth.

Woo Li asks that I convey the following:

"We have been asked to accept your invasion of the Carolingians without a military response on our part.  It has been done, allegedly, for the sake of The Path, The Truth, and The Words.  We must decide whether promulgation of The Path, The Truth, and The Words are worthy of the carnage you are planning to inflict. Therefore, it is very important to us to understand these things, as we meditate on these events.  This is why we bring our questions.

Is there really no right or wrong way to tread The Path?  One man walks with food and water, and tends the needs of his fellow travelers.  Another walks with a mask and a dagger, robbing travelers, and even injuring or killing them.  Do The Path, The Truth, and The Words really make no distinction?  Both men are equally faithfully following The Path?  If The Path makes no distinction, then just what is it that takes a lifetime to comprehend?

Some of our Greek neighbors to the north see life as in the hands of the Fates.  And we have heard that the Yourcenaeans saw the future goverened by the Fines.  As described by you thus far, we do not see that The Path is very different from these concepts of Fate or Fine.  Surely there must be more, or else where is your justification for war?"

Xiaowen, First Emperor of the Wei Dynasty

[DribNairb]

If I told you I did not believe a word you have ever said would you like it? Would you be angry? Would you consider this cause for vengeance? For war?

Maybe. Maybe not.

But what if I then went to all your people and was publically outspoken about this? If I attempted to undermine everything you stand for, everything you believe and everything you have ever known? And what if such an act had been decreed for all time to be considered an act of war - you would then be wrong in NOT declaring war!

You must remember in all of this, The Truth is but The Truth. We, The Founders, are here to promote The Path. The carolingian government has done it's best to undermine it. The greeks then joined in to satisfy their own thirst for war.

We have no wish for war and have stated this since the start. We are not at war to expand our borders (like the greek empire did). We merely require the carolingian leadership to stand down and admit their guilt. Instead, we get blasphemous remarks and ignorant screams of defiance.

[Levgre]

"If I told you I did not believe a word you have ever said would you like it? Would you be angry? Would you consider this cause for vengeance? For war?

Maybe. Maybe not."

That would stand against the Buddhist principles of tolerance and peace. Perhaps in a moment of weakness, there would be anger. But vengeance has no place in Buddhist doctrine, and our faith is secure no matter what others may say against us.  We would meditate and contemplate the anger in our homes, instead of traveling to take the homes of others.

All that can be done is to protect the innocent.  The Greeks do not want to continue this war, but they will not let the Carolingian people be conquered.

Andronikos

[DribNairb]

That would stand against the Buddhist principles of tolerance and peace. Perhaps in a moment of weakness, there would be anger. But vengeance has no place in Buddhist doctrine, and our faith is secure no matter what others may say against us.  We would meditate and contemplate the anger in our homes, instead of traveling to take the homes of others.

All that can be done is to protect the innocent.  The Greeks do not want to continue this war, but they will not let the Carolingian people be conquered.

Andronikos

I am confused if the Buddhist principles of tolerance and peace are being followed - why did you declare war?
But that is not really the subject to be discussed - if you wish to follow your own beliefs The Founders will not stop you. I am far more concerned that you suggest the carolingian people are being conquered - in fact we have no intention of conquering them. We have stated from the beginning that we only wish to see those who blaspheme against The Truth be taken from control of the nation. As far as I am aware this consists of a mere handful of individuals amongst the carolingian leadership (who, I assume, are now living in their palace protected by their enslaved subjects). From talking to the citizens of 3 cities now not under their waywardly rule it is clear that most carolingians are not adverse to The Truth and many have requested to learn more about The Path.

It is our intention to protect the innocent too. The few carolingian leaders who prevent this are the only problem in the equation. Your own declaration has merely ensured the deaths of a far greater number of innocent civilians.

[Levgre]

"I am confused if the Buddhist principles of tolerance and peace are being followed - why did you declare war?"

Along with tolerance and peace is justice, the need to protect the innocent.  We did not know the Dokko and their character, but the Carolingians are our neighbors and we believe them to be peaceful until shown otherwise...  so war was declared to protect the Carolingian nation.  The Greek empire does not have aggressive intentions, and does not plan to attack civilians, only foreign invaders.
It seems apparent that the path of war and conquest has been decided, despite the claim that your alliance "has no intention of conquering them".

Andronikos

[DribNairb]

I do not wish to get into an argument about buddhist intentions, but it seems odd that you claim to protect the innocent through peace and tolerance, yet happily invaded your own neighbours for your own benefit. However, this particular topic is something to be discussed by historians another time as I believe it will only lead us away from our mutual goal to stop the war on our continent.


It is important to distinguish the actions of The Founders from the actions of the coalition. The Founders have no intention of conquering our neighbours purely for economic gain. In this case we aim to remove the leaders of carolingia from power. To do so involved the coalition acting as one in war.

The current occupation of some carolingian cities by coalition forces is a requirement of our situation. It is not an attempt at conquering them to absorb them into The Founders empire as you seem to suggest.

I personally have no quarrel with whoever remains in control of carolingia so long as they do not attempt to undermine The Path. I will admit I would first prefer to see a government from The Founders or another nation who publically follows The Path, but first and foremost it must not be a leader who attempts to undermine everything The Truth stands for.

I believe this conversation may be best persued in The Founders embassy where you have made the bold first steps towards peace.

[Carolus Maltman]

If I told you I did not believe a word you have ever said would you like it? Would you be angry? Would you consider this cause for vengeance? For war?

Maybe. Maybe not.

But what if I then went to all your people and was publically outspoken about this? If I attempted to undermine everything you stand for, everything you believe and everything you have ever known? And what if such an act had been decreed for all time to be considered an act of war - you would then be wrong in NOT declaring war!

You must remember in all of this, The Truth is but The Truth. We, The Founders, are here to promote The Path. The carolingian government has done it's best to undermine it. The greeks then joined in to satisfy their own thirst for war.

We have no wish for war and have stated this since the start. We are not at war to expand our borders (like the greek empire did). We merely require the carolingian leadership to stand down and admit their guilt. Instead, we get blasphemous remarks and ignorant screams of defiance.

This is still a posthumous justification for war. You started the war and invaded our lands BEFORE giving us a chance to respond to your allegations, and then we responded harshly BECAUSE you were already marching close to our cities, weapons drawn.

Are you prescient, and knew we would "blaspheme" in advance, to justify your war? We have already disproved all your pretexts for war.

And have also proven that your allied commanders are no match for our Righteous Coalition of Defense, in the 1st Battle of the Mosel Shores, and the 1st Battle in Defense of Vienna. Your skulls will proclaim their version of the Truth outside our city walls for all eternity.

Of course, we are tolerant of different faiths, and would be happy to accept your missionaries into Mainz, Ulm and Augsberg after you return them to their rightful place as part of the Carolingian Empire.

[Levgre]

I do not wish to get into an argument about buddhist intentions, but it seems odd that you claim to protect the innocent through peace and tolerance, yet happily invaded your own neighbours for your own benefit. However, this particular topic is something to be discussed by historians another time as I believe it will only lead us away from our mutual goal to stop the war on our continent.

That was done at a time where the majority of Greeks were not yet Buddhists, but still followed various forms of paganism or polytheism.  While the majority of Greece people are Buddhist, we are not a Buddhist state, but a Democratic Republic.  A vote was carried out and the vote to war succeeded.  As was the vote to defend Carolingian lands.  If the same sort of aggressive war was put to vote now, the vote would almost certainly fail.

Andronikos